Nancy Hyne is a sustainability advisor and founder of True Horizon Sustainability Strategies.
Her mission is to support SMEs with no-nonsense strategy and support. Getting to the heart of your sustainability goals, Nancy helps impact driven companies revamp their business model to balance people, profit and the planet. She’s based in the beautiful New Forest area in the south of England, but works with businesses across the UK and the world.
Her services include:
Katherine Ann Byam 0:01
Is there something more that small businesses should be thinking about contributing to, to sort of help the ecology but also the society around them?
Nancy Hyne 0:11
I think this is one again, where that engagement piece is key. Like if we if we think at the moment cost of living is skyrocketing. So probably if you have employees, they're a little bit nervous about how they're going to meet costs and things start to ask the question, it's no good you kind of offering free yoga if actually what they want to do is they might ned meal vouchers or, you know, whatever it might be, getting that engagement with your employees first as a starting point, what are the challenges you're facing? And how can we help paying a living wage? You know, what are the things that your employees need, from a community point of view, make it personal, yeah, you can go and plant trees, if that's what you want to do. Great. That's a positive thing to do. But if there's things going on in your local region, get people involved get the engagement, what matters to the employees, in your company, and in your local community.
Katherine Ann Byam 1:03
This is season five, the great debates of our times, Season Five will be centred around the great debates. And we will be comparing and contrasting different viewpoints on various topics that are consuming the public discourse at present. The reason I've decided to take this approach is because, we or at least many of us, are losing the skill of debate. And I think this is an essential skill for us all to practice once more. I don't see how we get to the point of saving the world and saving our planet, if we don't know how to discuss our differences. I also think that the solution to most of our challenges is somewhere in the spectrum of views but never at either extreme. I will be working with guests to curate the content and discuss beforehand, I will understand their positions, their areas of genius, and navigate my questions around that so that the conversation is challenging and stimulating without being combative. I hope you enjoy Season Five of Where Ideas launch; The Sustainable Innovation Podcast. Nancy Hyne is a sustainability advisor and founder of true horizon sustainability strategies. Her mission is to support SMEs with no nonsense strategy and support. Getting to the heart of your sustainability goals, Nancy helps impact driven companies revamp their business models to balance people, profit and the planet. She's based in the beautiful new forest area in the south of England, but works for businesses across the UK and the world. Nancy, welcome to Where Ideas launch.
Nancy Hyne 2:32
Thank you for having me, Katherine.
Katherine Ann Byam 2:34
Really wonderful to have you and really wonderful to have someone from the New Forest. I love the new forest. Me and my partner spend a lot of time there when we can because I live in the centre of Southampton but we often take a day trip to walk in the woods.
Nancy Hyne 2:47
You should definitely give me a call next time you're down. You'll, you'll have two Labradors in tow. But yeah, we're out there all the time.
Katherine Ann Byam 2:55
That's perfect, we have a date. So we've been connected for some time on LinkedIn exchanging comments and a lot of positive energy, but we've never managed speak. So this is really a pleasure. So thank you for joining me. And I want to start with your why. And that's where any good story begins. So tell us how you came to run your environmental advisory practice and what the sustainability movement means to you.
Nancy Hyne 3:18
Yeah, so I actually started my career as a structural engineer, so designing buildings, and I chose engineering, a little bit out of the blue, I wanted to travel and I did end up travelling, I ended up working in Sydney. And I started working on quite a cool project that was very focused on sustainability and community. And I kind of realised that I liked that side of it more than the actual structural design. So I did a bit of a sidestep while I was out there. And I started looking at kind of new build design, how we can use buildings better and be more efficient. But when I moved back to the UK, it's quite a different market. And also we have a lot of old building stock here. So it became much more about looking at the way businesses operate. Yes, of course, the building feeds into that. But you know, looking at things like business, travel and energy consumption, you know, how do we change the way that we work, and use our buildings to be more sustainable to be more responsible. And I worked in corporate for a long time, which is great, because I learned a huge amount, but I started to realise that there was not as much support available for SMEs. And here in the UK SMEs account for over 99% of businesses, they have a huge impact. And they often don't have those in house teams. They don't necessarily have the budgets, you know, they can't hire the big consultants who are desperate to work for the big companies. But I realised that there was some really great, sustainable, responsible businesses coming through, you know, people who had left the corporate world, wanted to do things a bit differently, but they didn't have the support that they needed. I think also the move from London to the new forest had a big impact. You know, a lot of people who are not based in London, don't live in London for a reason, you know, they want that space, they want the countryside, they want the new forest, they want all of these things. And I started to wonder if there was a way that we could kind of level the playing field, how do we give those businesses the opportunity to compete against the larger corporates, but also to give them that chance to grow and evolve their business in a way that feels right and ethical for them without a huge admin burden, but also in a way that sort of profits, the business as well, you know, we want ethical responsible businesses to be profitable, to keep going, to survive and to compete against those big corporates. So that's kind of where I, where I started. So kind of using all the learnings from my corporate life, because quite often, these smaller businesses have large clients or, you know, they're being asked to do things by these larger clients. So being able to tap into that knowledge and give them the tools that need, they need to be able to compete and to thrive as well.
Katherine Ann Byam 5:59
This is really important that I'm glad that you're doing this. It's one of the reasons my partner and I also left the corporate world and decided to set up a business dedicated to SMEs, really. So I wanted to move to this experience that you've heard working with clients or general case studies, perhaps what do you know to be the characteristics of a company operating effectively as a B Corp?
Nancy Hyne 6:21
I think a lot of it comes down to motivation, you know, you, people come to a certification, like B Corp for lots of different reasons. The ones that I really love working with, and the ones that I kind of will filter out are those businesses that have a real desire to be better and to do better and have a positive impact. So I've worked with companies who are going through the certification process, and they really want to use that to learn and to kind of better their business, but also on the other side of B Corp, but once you've got that certification, it's a great accolade, you've worked really hard to get there. But what do you do next? And I think with any certification, it's all about that commitment to keep improving. So I think that's the ultimate drive for B Corp or any other certification that you really want to learn. And you're committed to change and to being better and to challenging that status quo about what being a business owner means and what the purpose of a business is. Beyond just putting money in shareholder pockets.
Katherine Ann Byam 7:22
Yeah, some will say that ESG, B Corp, all give businesses an opportunity for greenwashing, because the business itself doesn't have to be ethical, or to score full points on the assessments, what would be your response to those who doubt the merits of what we're trying to do with these metrics that we're coming up with?
Nancy Hyne 7:42
I think the reality is, there's always going to be an opportunity to skew things in your favour, to greenwash, to whatever you're doing. There's ways and means of doing it. I think the key thing is really to look at a companies transparency when they're doing this sort of things, if they're, if all they're doing is shouting about the good in inverted commas that they do, and they're never flagging the challenges, you know, the things that they're not doing well, we all, you know, business is inherently unsustainable, we are consuming, we're travelling we're, it is just, you know, by living, we have an impact. So yes, of course, there can be ways to skew it. And I think it's important to remember that no certification is perfect. It's not a symbol of perfection, it's a symbol of drawing a line in the sand and committing to improvement. So I think it gets a little bit dangerous if we sort of throw it out all together, because it's, it's actually really unfair on the businesses that have done it for the right reasons, heart lead, and are committed to being better. But I also think, and we kind of touched on this earlier in the week, there's huge changes coming to B Corp over the next few years, and they're in the middle of a consultation phase at the moment, and the proposals are quite different, there's going to be a lot of impact to current B Corps, and to ones that are planning to certify in the future, and I think that's right, I think so much has changed in society over the last few years. And we have to address that, we do have to keep changing and improving and challenging ourselves. And it'll be interesting to see whether you know, some B Corps decide that it's no longer the root for them. And it will be interesting to see how attainable some of the things that they're talking about, because there are some really challenging areas that we have to address. And how do we make it accessible for all businesses and try and weed out the people who are trying to kind of just make it a marketing ploy. So there's a, there's a tricky balance there.
So we're gonna come back to the changes, but I wanted to first touch on some of the content of what that B Corp assessment is. So, I myself, have done the B Impact assessment on my own business, and I never moved forward to make my business a B Corp, for the reasons we've been discussing, probably before we actually got onto the session, but for me, and I guess for people who are listening who are on the fence or thinking about it, could you explain what the B Impact assessment really does? And probably go into a little bit about where people need the most help, usually, when you get involved with helping them through this assessment.
Yeah, so the thing I like about B Corp is that it's very holistic. So you're looking, there's not many certifications that, that, take that wider view, there's a lot that focus on environment or social, but this kind of looks at everything. So you've got five sections from governance, community, workers, customers, and environment. So you're really looking at every business decision you're making. And the idea is that you go through the assessment, and you answer questions, and you get scored based on the industry your in, the size of your business. So the questions are tailored based on those differences in businesses, and you are aiming to get a minimum of 80 points across all of those sections. And what I tend to find is, particularly for SMEs, there's two areas that come up a lot. One is the governance side of things, as a small business you might not have, you might do things a certain way, but you may not have policies, formal policies in place. And that can feel a little bit daunting for businesses. I went through the B Corp process for my own business. And it felt a little weird writing policies for myself. But actually, it's cemented some of the things that I've been thinking about, and it made me really sit down and think, okay, how do I operate in this space. And it's also come in quite handy for project bids and stuff, if people are asking about your values, you can point them to, you know, a code of conduct or an environmental policy. So, but it can feel a little bit daunting, if you're not used to that. The other big one is environment, you're going to struggle to score any points if you're not sort of calculating and tracking emissions. And that can be really a challenging task for a lot of companies. I see it a lot with again, particularly with SMEs, just you know where to start, and how to unravel all the terminology and make sense of what a tonne of carbon looks like. And, you know, what does, what's different scope. So that tends to be another area that I focus on quite a lot with, I normally, you know, there's a bit of a mixture, I think, going through the process highlights what you do really well. So you might look after your employees really well. But it also highlights the areas where you have room for improvement. So it's a really good process to go through. And you can start setting longer term goals for where you want to take your business and how you want to improve it. And I think you know, even that getting to certification is such a great process. And it's fantastic to watch businesses make changes and, and get excited about what they're doing and how they're improving.
Katherine Ann Byam 12:50
This is wonderful. And let's touch a little bit on some of the key tips to bringing yourself up to that 80, 80 level, what are some, some great ideas that people have been able to implement relatively easily.
Nancy Hyne 13:06
The the big, quick wins tend to be the policy ones. So yeah, they take a little bit of time to sit down and think about and write. But it's kind of a no cost option, which is great, if you don't have massive budgets to align to it. One of the things I'd really recommend is not leaving it to one person in the business, get engagement built, bring people into it, they're going to have ideas they're going to have, you know, they're, and you're also going to find out what else is going on in other areas of the business that you can focus on, you want to tailor it, you know, if you're about to do a big recruitment drive, have a look at the employee section, make it relevant to where your business is at now, you know, it's going to help you think about the wording you use in job adverts or how accessible they are, how are you building diversity into your business. So make it really relevant for for what's going on in your business at that particular point in time. And you know, have, have things in your back pocket for future use as well. Because some there won't be, there will be things in there that you think we actually can't do that now for whatever reason, don't worry about that focus on the things you can do. But really build that engagement across the business to get feedback. And because you're going to need you know, people from finance, or HR or whatever it is. So really make sure to get them involved. And try not to look at it as just ticking boxes make it really relevant to where your business is at and the the kind of immediate areas that you want to improve on.
Katherine Ann Byam 14:28
Okay, this is fair enough. I want to ask another question about the carbon tracking. Do we all need to consider implementing an environmental management system? Is there a carbon app we can use? What's the best practice here?
Nancy Hyne 14:40
I think it is an important thing to do. Whether you go down a certification route with your environmental management system or not is by the by, but you can't really understand your impact or improve it if you don't have the numbers. So while it can feel a little bit daunting, it's really going to help you target particular areas. So, so often businesses come to me and they say, you know, we've got rid of plastic, we're reducing our waste, we don't really know what next, because they don't actually know the impact that, that's having, you know, they don't know, I worked with a company, I've been working with them for a couple of years, and we were looking at their overall emissions, and we found that, you know, something like 60, or 70% of their emissions came from their deliveries. So that gave us a real opportunity to go, okay, that's going to be our focus for the next 12 months, how do we reduce that? What are the ways that we can look at reducing that impact and improving our sort of environmental credential? So yes, it's really important that you have those numbers, and that you're tracking and monitoring that going forward, not just for the reduction, but so you can celebrate your wins as well. Otherwise, how do you know the impacts that you're having? So you don't necessarily need to have a certification to do that. But it's a really good starting point. And it feeds into what we call sort of materiality. Are you, what are the key aspects in your business that are influencing the people planet, so you know, again, being able to identify areas that have a big environmental impact, therefore, they are quite material in your business, and you need to, you know, start writing policies, you know, if it's travel, you know, maybe your business travel is quite high, that you have to go out and buy a whole fleet of electric vehicles, that's probably not feasible for most businesses overnight. But you can start implementing travel policies, or perhaps have a electric pool car that people can use. So it just gives you ideas for where your biggest impact is, and how you start to set targets and understand those numbers and where you have room for improvement.
Katherine Ann Byam 16:43
I agree, you're speaking to the converted definitely here and probably on the podcast in general, let's let's pivot to small businesses and social impact. Because I know, I know that you say that, you know, there's some assessments that look mainly at the social impacts and not necessarily at the environment, and therefore you spend a lot more time helping people to sort the environmental side. But in terms of the social impact, is there something more that small businesses should be thinking about contributing to, to sort of help the ecologi, but also the society around them?
Nancy Hyne 17:15
Yeah, and I think this is one again, where that engagement piece is key. Like if we if we think at the moment, cost of living is skyrocketing. So probably, if you have employees, they're a little bit nervous about how they're going to meet costs and things, start to ask the question, it's no good you kind of offering free yoga, if actually what they want to do is, they might need meal vouchers, or, you know, whatever it might be. So getting that engagement with your employees first as a starting point, what are the challenges you're facing? And how can we help? You know, being, giving them that financial security, I think is so important, paying a living wage, is a start, you know, how, what are the things that your employees need to feel secure, it's going to impact their mental health, from a community point of view, make it personal, yeah, you can go plant trees, if that's what you want to do. Great. That's a positive thing to do. But if there's things going on in your local region, I worked with a client recently, and they wanted to do something really community based, and I introduced them to the Solent Seagrass Project. So they're gonna go and sponsor, so if you're not aware, or if any of your listeners aren't aware. Seagrass has so much potential for sequestering carbon. And it's a fantastic, Solent's doing a lot of research here in the Solent region. But actually, there's seagrass projects across the country. And they felt that, that was really personal to them. It was part of their local community, they're a local business. So make it personal, like get people involved, get the engagement, what matters to the employees, in your company, and in your local community, all of these different groups of stakeholders, understanding what is important to them, and what they need from you, in terms of your social and environmental impact is really key. And it really helps to form a strategy that is relevant to the people that you impact.
Katherine Ann Byam 19:01
Yeah, absolutely. This one's kind of big. Do you think our current systems of politics and economics can adapt in sufficient time to help us keep warming to below one point five to two degrees? And I'm not asking you for what you hope for, I'm asking you for what you think.
Nancy Hyne 19:17
In a word? No, I don't, I don't think so. I don't think here in the UK, I can't speak globally, but I don't think here in the UK that climate action is as much of a priority as it should be at the moment, without dwelling too much on the stuff that's happening in number 10, at the moment. Yeah, I think we're not seeing policies that are going to really help us act. But that said, I almost think in a way it's irrelevant. Do we need to wait for legislation to act or are there enough businesses who care enough that they will act, particularly for small businesses, so there was a recent study by the British Business Bank and they found that that when it comes to UK businesses and the emissions associated with UK businesses, SMEs account for 50% of that, that is a big chunk of emissions that SMEs are responsible for. And genuinely when there's environmental legislation coming through SMEs fall below the sort of the, they're not caught up in that legislation, like the larger corporates are. So maybe it's time to stop waiting for legislation and just, people to start acting, we can do it without government if we need to, and actually sharing our journeys and encouraging others and showing how it can be done and being honest about the challenges that we're facing. And building that collaboration is so important. So maybe we don't need, I mean, the government should be acting, but maybe it's time to stop waiting for them and just to take matters into our own hands and start making these changes without waiting for them, and without waiting to see what policies they're going to implement. Because if nothing else, even if they implemented a load policies today, it would still take time to filter through and have an impact. And we're kind of out of time. So we need immediate action, even if that starting small, great start, start it, build the motivation and go from there. But I think we've got to stop waiting for government because it's we're not seeing enough of a push, and we need it, we need, we need people to just take matters into their own hands.
Katherine Ann Byam 21:21
So I like that response. And I'm gonna say something. So when I started in business three, four years ago, I remember thinking that at the time, I thought that people weren't aware of all the challenges. And you know, it's quite a lot to get your head around, because there's so many angles to this stuff. But actually, now I've come to think that it's not a lack of awareness that we're suffering from, it's okay, I've got to take care of me. And this is quite a challenge, right? And we're moving from a place of, oh, it's all abundance, you know, go out and conquer the world, because there's enough here for everyone. And let's just go take, and now people are realising maybe it's not like that, but they don't want to be left holding the bag. So even though they know a lot of people are still acting, let's say, out of integrity with the planet, what are your thoughts on how, how we shift that? Is it possible to shift it?
Nancy Hyne 22:16
For some, yes, I think for some, you know, there's just that element of, I don't care. If it's not directly impacting me, I don't care, which is kind of a sad place to be. But on the flip side, I have seen so many incredible businesses coming through who actually, their barrier isn't not caring, it's not kind of knowing where to start? Or how to make that first step or what, what are the big impact, impactful changes that they should be making? So I think there's been this, there's this real sense of judgement, when it comes to sustainability, everyone's quick to say, that's the wrong thing to do. You can't do this, you have to do this. And it's not helpful. In fact, I think it's a deterrent, and it stops people being able to share and ask questions and have conversations. And I think that's been a big problem. And I think the more that we see businesses thrive, and the impact the positive impacts they're having. And I've seen a lot of this, you know, on LinkedIn, I've seen stories about companies who are paying their workers, energy bills, and you know, all of this stuff, and we see it and we go, yeah, okay, there is change, there are people who care, and the more that people are talking about that sort of thing, and showing how we can do it differently and challenging what the norm is, the more people I think, will see it as a viable option. Not everyone, I'm sure, but it's going to build that momentum it's going to build, if we're a bit more accepting and where people are starting their journey from where they're, where they're at, at that point in time. I mean, I'm certainly not perfect. I'm not vegan, I don't drive an electric car, you know, there's a lot of things that I could change to, but if I stopped talking about, you know, or supporting other people, it's, it's kind of having the opposite effect that it should be. So we just need to be a little bit more understanding and a little bit more encouraging of others.
Katherine Ann Byam 24:21
Yeah, this, you remind me of a debate I had with someone a few months back, which was, I drive a diesel car, it's since 2016. I maintain it really well. So it's not like emitting more than it should, etcetera. I don't want to replace it because just, just taking a car off the shop floor is already costing so much in terms of resource extraction and conversion. And it's difficult to make these kinds of decisions, right. It's like you drive around as someone advocating for sustainability in a diesel car and everybody looks at you like; what? What are you doing, but, but it's more complex than that, right. And you know, how do we, how do we raise that awareness about all these things?
Nancy Hyne 25:06
Yeah, exactly that. And I think you've got to be a little bit thick skinned and be willing to put your hand up and say, I'm not perfect. I know, there's more things that I could do and, what you know, do I shop at shop on Amazon? Yes, I try to buy locally, and I try to support small business, but sometimes I, you know, there isn't an alternative that works, whether it's timings or price or whatever. And that's okay. It's about making the better choices when you can and working to improve. And the more that we do that, the more options are available to us, you know, we are going to rely on on technology, we need to, we need better tech to support what we're doing. And we have a lot of power in where we spend our money as an individual and as a business, the more that we support businesses that are doing things differently, the more that they can provide us with better alternatives. So yeah, I think, you know, we run the risk of beating ourselves up over every decision we make that isn't as sustainable as we'd like it to be. But to what end, you know, we're all sort of imperfect, it's all about imperfect sustainability, because of course, we have an impact. But how can we become more conscious in what we're consuming and and who we're buying from? And I think certainly with with COVID, it's just highlighted so many of these inequalities, and I guess the system is ultimately broken, so how do we start to shift that change? It's difficult, and it will take time, but to kind of keep again, in a similar way, getting better informing ourselves, you know, starting to learn about what other options are, and just being more vocal about what's out there and what's available.
Katherine Ann Byam 26:46
Yeah, it's, it's fascinating to me just to touch very lightly on the war in Ukraine at the moment, because that's having so many repercussions in Africa and around the world. But what I realised earlier this year, how many nuclear weapons that have been developed around the world, when we only need one or two, for things to be game over for all of us, it's quite amazing that we've allowed that level of investment in something so useless.
Nancy Hyne 27:15
Yeah. And something so terrifying.
Katherine Ann Byam 27:18
Yeah, and it just, it just makes me think that we definitely have issues with our priorities. And we're not likely to probably overcome these things. Which brings me to my next question, what adaptation strategies have you looked at, which might still bring us hope? If we can't manage the two degrees?
Nancy Hyne 27:37
This is such a difficult one. Because I think ultimately, we know that the results will be catastrophic. We just don't know how catastrophic. So we were joking earlier about, you know, does everyone go and build an ark? You know, what do we do? How do we manage this? And I think the reality is, we don't know, I couldn't tell you, as you were talking about some of these crazy ideas that people have folding work, maybe but how do we plan for something where we don't quite know what it looks like? You know, I think there will be, we're already seeing sort of climate, refugees, people who can't live and work and survive in the places they were in. I don't think there's a simple solution to that, or even a complex solution to that, I ultimately think that the result is going to be a lot of deaths. I don't know that there's a way we fix this after the fact, we need to be very focused, at the moment, I think, on how do we stop this happening in the first place? As far as we possibly can? Because I don't know what happens after that!
Katherine Ann Byam 28:37
Yeah, it's such a, it's such a challenging puzzle. And I feel on my side, i feel as if we need to do both. So we need to stop the damaging things. But we also need to prepare, because I think if we, from what I'm seeing, I'm struggling to see that we're going to do what we need to do, especially in the timeframe that we really should do it. You know, there's so many discussions about timeframes. And every scientific paper that I've read suggests that 2030 is already pushing it. Right. And we're talking 2040 2050, which 2035 for for the sale of diesel and petrol cars and stuff like this. And it seems too far away. It seems. I can tell you right now, in October in the UK, I'm still walking around in short sleeves when I go to the park, right, which is like, I've never done that before. This is the first year that I feel like yeah, like this is happening. So it's coming as you can, you can definitely sense that there's a big change afoot. And I feel as if we need to work towards adapting where we can, finding those solutions where we can reallocate people, I don't know, this if Ttis actually makes sense, but we need to find ways that we can redistribute and look at how we can adapt for those who really need it right now because there are a lot of people who are in dire circumstances at the moment but I'm gonna leave that there because it is quite a sad one. And I want to say what, what recommendations or small actions would you recommend to households to accommodate the changes that they need to make?
Nancy Hyne 30:11
Yeah, one of the biggest things you can do on a personal level is your money. Who do you bank with? Where's your pension investment? You know, you were talking about, you know, nuclear weaponry? Well, the chances are, if you haven't specifically opted out, your pension is invested in fossil fuels, it's invested in arms trading. And this is something that is becoming talked about a lot more. And it's a fantastic way to actually say, look, my money has power, and I'm not putting it in those things. I'm not supporting those things. So yeah, look at who you bank with where your investments are, pensions, things like that. But also consumption, you know, whether that's energy consumption, or the food we consume, or the waste that we produce, be a little bit more conscious of what you're buying. And what that means, again, it comes down to our money and the power that we have. And you know, we mentioned government, and yes, they're slow, but we need to be much more vocal about what we expect from government, I think a lot of people are probably frustrated with the goings on at the moment. But if we don't speak out, if we don't talk and raise our voices, again, that collective power is really important. And voting, please, please, please, you know, use your voice, we've been given it and you have an opportunity to, to shout about the things that are important to you. So use it and use it wisely.
Katherine Ann Byam 31:34
Okay, I want to bring us back to a positive note to wrap this up, because we've been going down a very dire place . And I really want to bring us back. So what I want to ask is share with us a campaign or company or someone who has inspired you in the last year or so in terms of the work that you're doing, or things that you've seen. And let's see what we can get from that example.
Nancy Hyne 32:00
There's a client that I've been working with for a couple of years now, they actually came to me after they got B Corp certified, because they went, what do we do now? How do we get better, and they are a coffee provider, they're really small business. So you know, a lot of times people go, we can't do things as a small business, we haven't got the budgets, we haven't got, you know, whatever it is, but you can and they're doing a lot of really fantastic work. I mean, the coffee industry is so complex. And there's a lot of injustices associated that the climate impacts are huge for the industry. And I love seeing the sort of passion and the ambition in what they're doing, and how they are really working hard to understand their impacts across the supply chain. And to really choose carefully who they work with. Some of their suppliers, for example, are helping farmers actually calculate whether they're making a profit or not, they've developed support and tools to help these farmers work out what it costs to live, and therefore what they need to be charging. They're taking the onus off and the risk levels, you know, if the farmer is not paid properly, and they're wiped out by a flood or a drought, for example, what do they do? And why is it fair that that one person takes all the responsibility in that supply chain, so the work that they've been doing and the projects that are going on supporting local communities and how they're empowering those communities, it's just really phenomenal. And it's, it's really fantastic to see. And it's hard work, you know, it's not an easy fix. But to see that sort of dedication and how it's really part of who they are as a business. And the core of what they do is really inspiring.
Katherine Ann Byam 33:34
Thank you for that. It gives me goosebumps, yes, to know that there are people who are trying to make a difference where it really matters, I, I've collaborated with a few handloomers in India, and they were trying to explain to me the supply chain for what they do, and how little of that benefit they actually receive. And, you know, they kind of work in sort of communities. And it's a bit like it almost feels as if this person who's co-ordinating them has to make sure that they have all the medication that they need and all this sort of thing because the income that they're making doesn't allow them to go to the hospitals or whatever it is right. And you realise that one of the ladies that I spoke to she wanted to use blockchain to help trace the whole supply chain etc. So that she could help those farmers more and I thought, wow, this kind of story really fills me with, with hope, right, that we can, we can use technology, we can use various things to try to make a difference in real people's lives. Yeah. And that matters.
Nancy Hyne 34:37
It matters so much. And it's raising that awareness as well. You know, I certainly is guilty of you know, seeing a fair trade sticker and assuming great I've done my bit. You know, there's more to it, we need people to know the challenges so that they can act and behave differently. But yeah, it's so inspiring to see, it fills me with so much hope it's great from a selfish perspective, it makes my job a lot of fun.
Katherine Ann Byam 35:03
On that note, what advice would you give to consultants starting in this area and wanting to do more to help,
Nancy Hyne 35:09
I think focus on your, where you're sort of niche where your talent is, you know, sustainability, responsibility affects everything that we do. Maybe it's diversity and inclusion, and maybe it's environmental impact. We're all coming at this from different areas. So we need different voices and different views and different skill sets. So work out what's important to you, what really, you know, if you're watching the news at night, what is the thing that makes you go, I really want to do something about that, and focus on that particular area, because we need that talent. And that passion is what's going to make you really good at that particular area. And we need that we really need that.
Katherine Ann Byam 35:47
Perfect, Nancy, it's been a pleasure, I think we've covered every possible base we could, and I've really enjoyed the conversation, let my listeners know how they can get in touch with you and work with you if they want to in the future.
Nancy Hyne 36:00
The best way to sort of find out what I do is LinkedIn, I'm pretty active on there. So you know, stalk me for a bit if you're not willing to send me an email straightaway. But otherwise, I'm happy to share my email address and website and people can go in and have a look. And yeah, I'm always open for a chat. So if you want to talk anything through; feel free,
Katherine Ann Byam 36:18
Wonderful. So you're going to find Nancy's details in the show notes. Thank you, Nancy, very much for joining us and see you soon on LinkedIn or in person. Yeah, hopefully.
Nancy Hyne 36:26
Thank you so much, Katherine for having me.
Katherine Ann Byam 36:28
Take care.
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