Today, my guest is Karen Adams, founder and CEO of Kaia clothing. Karen made her first garment at the age of seven having grown up with a black and gold Singer sewing machine in her house. Watching fabric come to life in her mother's hands. She marvelled at how a flat piece of fabric could be transformed and engineered into 3d Clothes owned by the family. At 19. She started a small fashion business, she studied fashion design and fashion drawing at London central St. Martin School of Art. And later on, she chose the predictable and dependable roots of corporate retail immersing herself in the geekish side of merchandising and analysis. Clothing represents a return to her earliest passions with a desire to solve some of the sustainability challenges facing the industry in our lifetime.
Katherine Ann Byam
Karen, welcome to Where Ideas Launch.
Karen Adams 1:33
Thank you. It's great to be here.
Katherine Ann Byam 1:34
Really great to have you. We share a bit of an origin story, both our parents were born in Trinidad and Tobago, can you share a little bit about how your Caribbean roots potentially influenced your worldview on inclusion and equality and all of these things that you've all there?
Karen Adams 1:50
Sure. And I always am thrilled to meet someone from the land, you know, where my parents grew up from Trinidad and Tobago, and where I'm from the Trinidad and Tobago was very much alive to me, because my parents spoke about the place and the smell and the fruits and it felt like home even though I hadn't been there until I was about I think 10 years old. So we both spring from Trinidad and Tobago, and I do marvel that our experiences will be so different in that you lived in the majority, ethnically speaking. And I've always lived in the minority. So I always am, I always wonder about how that would have impacted my resilience and the many wounds that you inevitably acquire growing up in a sort of systemically racist environment for the most part, not always, and not in every way. But it's definitely there. And you definitely had to fend it off for your whole life. So I always marvel at what it might be like to be free from that. And at the same time you develop your own resilience. So as being a Brit, you do, you have to develop your own resilience and your identity and your ways of thriving in the world. But I love Trinidad and Tobago so much. I mean, I've been there, I've been there several times, it's home from home now. And you know, having this I've always regarded myself as dual heritage, or even try heritage because most of my mom's siblings went to the States. And so I have a very early experience of visiting there. And it's really served to increase my resilience, it's almost like I have additional vantage points that most of my peers just didn't have. So I was able to view the world through many lenses and angles. And that's only been a power to me.
Katherine Ann Byam 3:35
It's interesting what you say, because I think, you know, we can talk about this origin story and how, how people from the Caribbean who then move here in later life, how they experienced the difference because it's definitely different, it's definitely different being in a place where you're expected to grow and to thrive. In other places where that's not the norm, what you're doing has examples. So you don't have enough examples of strong black women, for example, being very successful in their careers. Where I come from there are loads of examples of that, even though, you know, I can't say that the Caribbean is well advanced in terms of equality between men and women. But definitely the matriarch of the family is a strong character in the Caribbean story. So having that has been, I think, tremendous for me, but you're right, I only noticed how powerful that was when I left that environment and saw something different. So it does have an impact. And it's almost like you have to learn again. From my perspective, I have to learn how to navigate this sort of web because it's not something that I'm used to. It's definitely been a learning curve for me as well. What were the pros and cons of your experiences working in retail if we move back into the retail setting and how that has influenced today,
Karen Adams 4:56
I'll start with the pros because there were many, many pros, I had come out of fashion, I attended a course this is how it began, I attended a course. And the title, of course, was start your own fashion business. It just shows where I was heading and what I wanted to do. And on that course, this guy was brilliant. He talked about the different facets and career options within the industry. And he spoke about merchandising, he described its function at the analysis and intricacies of the role. And he said it was a lucrative career. And so the light bulb went off, I thought it was fairly low risk to entry and lucrative. I'll go that way.
Because I by then I had tried to, you know, to spin up my first startup at 19, realised the costs were quite prohibitive, really, because then back in the day, you there was no internet, you had to either have a shop or sell offline, you know, to your friends, more sort of small groups as I did. So, you know, I found my inner geek. So there's many of me, I've got many sides to me, I've got the designer who loves to create and express myself through clothing, and I love to design, I love analytics. And I'm always analysing I see patterns in things on very limited datasets. And I feel very intuitive about forecasting. And my forecast will always really bang on. And I just had an instinct for them, which hasn't left.
So I kind of walked into another side of me that woke up and I loved my career. I love the pressure. I love the pace, I love the power of it. I love the fact that it was lucrative, and I was able to, you know, buy property several times over move, and you know, travel. But I loved using my mind in that way, it was really mentally challenging and very difficult work. And I loved it. So these were all positives. And this really helped my sense of self to flourish. And I found another side of me that was highly disciplined and high performing.
On the negative side, there are people who will hate you for being great at your job. And then they always tended to fall amongst my peers, people on my sort of ranking your organisation. So senior management, you look across horizontally, they're the ones who are threatened. And that's where the danger lies. So I had a couple of bullying episodes, I'm in life bound to my full resilience and my fight back. I just didn't know how to do that. My parents were quite strict, and they took away the ability for me to say no, and to protest loudly, which didn't serve me well, I have to say. So I was a little bit vulnerable, I guess, to the sort of toxic people you can find in the workplace. But that's not to say I mean, I still walked with confidence and effectiveness and so on. So it was more than my inner world, you know, I felt vulnerable in some senses, I kind of grew tired of it, after 11 years of adding millions to the bottom line of Big Blue Chip corporations, many of which have now sunk into that big black hole in the high street during the pandemic. But anyway, I grew tired of adding millions to their bottom lines. And I wanted to do something more purposeful. So I kind of had a spiritual awakening. And I wanted to do something for the good of humanity, not just adding dollars to big companies,
Karen Adams 8:17
I do think it brought about your spiritual awakening. So a number of things happened in my personal life, involving racism involving toxic people that I should have been able to trust. I'm a very sensitive person. So I can't just brush off betrayal or treachery, it wounds me, deep down. And so that was something I needed to fix internally, or, you know, to improve my resilience. Although I'm still sensitive, frankly, things still upset me. So I have to guard against what I let into me. I began a search to find out why life hurts so much and why people are so unpleasant. You know, I was just so curious. And so upset by it. I just went on a quest to find out a little bit more. So I left and took a psychology degree, I ended up working with vulnerable adults with severe learning disability and epilepsy. And it was the most epic journey of my life, finding the wonder in different brain types, finding the love there, and the personality that was just the most amazing adventure.
So I entered for a short time, the world of child protection and social work, which I also loved. So there's so many, there's so many. There's so many of me here. And I guess I'm trying to visit them all because I can you can't I can't deny the musician in me or the care in me or the psychologist in me or the you know, analysts to me, or the engineering me I can't sort of deny all of those and just do one thing because I've left everything on tap. The road was longer and more windy than I ever imagined. I thought a couple of stops now kind of resume getting back into the system. And just you know, but it didn't, it didn't go like that and I guess my current venture is part of that journey.
Katherine Ann Byam 9:57
It's incredible. Your story I want to ask you, how are you now addressing the sort of experiences and concerns that you've had, or the challenges that you've had in the ethos of what is Kaia clothing?
Karen Adams 10:11
Right. So I describe clothing as my phoenix rising it, you know, this is the culmination, this is where I stop in life and gather up all of me. And Kira clothing embodies all of those counts, all of those passions, all of those heart desires, all of her spirit, you know, that's all in there. And I designed it, I reached a point. So after the child protection, social work episode, I started my family. I had my son, he had very high needs as a child, I had a really nice job, assessing families, and because of his high needs, they wouldn't give me the flexibility I needed. So they said, you either come back full time, or you don't come back. So they took my job. And that's when I returned to entrepreneurship, full throttle, because I had to work on my own terms. So that's where my entrepreneurial journey began, it wouldn't have now of course, because we know that work from home can work. But then there was this notion that Alicia chained to someone else's desk, you couldn't effectively work. So. So having taken this entrepreneurial route, I decided that all of my desires for the world to make it better, to try and bring some love and fairness and justice into the entrepreneurial endeavour. This is embodied in Kaia clothing. So what that looks like is, for example, that I sought to become a B Corp, which originally the name was benefit corporation, it's a for-profit business, that it's designed and incorporated to do good in the world and have a positive impact. And part of my business model is that with every sale, a proportion is donated to a domestic abuse charity. And I've recently partnered with the British Heart Foundation to introduce circularity and also give to them. And of course, running a business involves all of the career skills that I've acquired, nothing is wasted. It's a zero waste endeavour,
Katherine Ann Byam 12:06
Who does Kaia Clothing target and why?
Karen Adams 12:10
You know, I've thought long and hard about this. And in corporate retail, especially, you clearly define your target customer, she has a name, she has a profession and an address right down to the tee, and you target her at the exclusion of all others. I'm adopting a different philosophy with chi clothing, because ultimately, the target audience is anyone who cares about the planet.
But in addition to that, it's targeted at people who use clothing to express themselves. So you know, I think we all do that to an extent, you know, we dress to say something, but some people talk, you know, through their clothes more than others. And they use texture and colour and style and cut and all these things to tell a story is storytelling in the way that a dancer or a musician will tell a story through their performance. For some clothing is a performance and you're, you're communicating who you are. So it's for people like that, who love clothes, but don't want to indulge in the damage, but want something a little bit different and expressive.
Katherine Ann Byam 13:09
How are you measuring and managing your footprint and circular model as a clothing brand for people who are purchasing from you?
Karen Adams 13:18
So I only purchased materials and finished goods and fabrics that are certified that have a traceable origin. Right, right back to the seed in the ground. And that's the only way to be really sure. You know, when I stand in front of people and I say these are sustainable, these will not deplete more than they won't take excessively, that can't be generated. So when I stand in front of people and declare that I need that to be bombproof to be true. So certification is what I look for.
So I use GOT certified fabrics. So my bamboos and cottons I've got certified. They're made by a small cooperative in India that do a lot of hand looming, and they use a lot of rain in the feeding of the cotton as it's growing and so on with low pesticide to no pesticide use. I have bought T-shirts that have the Greens credentials in the industry. So they're made in purpose-built solar powered facilities and they are fair trade and they are organic. So I go for either high credentials to offer the assurance, what I am trying to balance is the additional cost of doing so. Because you know, until I reach scale, you know, it's more expensive to conserve the planet than to trash it, especially with clothing. But this will be true until I hit scale.
So early support is vital so that I can get those economies of scale and bring prices to not cheap, but bring them down. I buy Irish linens that are made by a family run business centre. They come from Belgium where most of the world's fine linen is grown and harvested as their special techniques. Their linen is so beautiful. It is such a beautiful manufacturing story that you know, it grows in three months, it's fed by the elements, you put it up by hand, it's called retting. And you lay all these bundles of linen in the fields, and then the rain and the sun, everything that nature is complete, that process decays the outer skin so that you can get to the inside and the stock comb and thrashing the inner fibres that make linen flax. So I love that. I love that manufacturing process of linens,
Katherine Ann Byam 15:31
this is a really important thing, I really think it's, it's important to understand how fabric is made and how, where it comes from. And I think this is an understanding I didn't have before my interest in sustainability, for sure. So it's really interesting to learn this from you from someone who's a connoisseur, per se, of fabric.
Karen Adams 15:49
I'm reading and you know, watching consuming content all the time to just learn more and more and more especially about manufacturing, and under the chemical side to really understand the full extent of the damage and the choices. I know
Katherine Ann Byam 16:03
that leading a sustainable fashion brand is challenging, definitely, there is no business that is untouched by the movement towards sustainability today, because I would say it is now widely accepted that we need to have more than a profit motive. But it doesn't mean that things are ready yet. So as you talk about, you know, the higher cost of doing business in a sustainable way, this cost is as a result of the fact that negative externalities haven't been factored into the cost of doing business the old way. And as those things begin to be factored in, as we start looking at ways to factor those things in as we build up on things like ESG reporting and looking at wider risks to this the ecosystem, as it were, what sort of challenges you've overcome already, that you want to share and talk about with others who might be on this journey as well.
Karen Adams 17:04
Because sustainability is still fringe, I would class it as fringe. And the reason I'd class is that it is free. And just because you have to search hard to find sustainable materials that stand up to scrutiny, you know, I have to search hard to find the threads, the elastics, the fabrics, the commitment to sustainability, right down the supply chain, I have to seek them out. So it takes a little longer to find your suppliers if I were unscrupulous and what was prepared to sneak in a little less here and little that I'd be able to move more quickly and more cheaply. So it costs to commit to sustainability in time and in money.
So they're the biggest challenges having said that, that this fringe community is growing exponentially. And it's such a warm and lovely place, because people are on a venture to save the planet. And their commitment is just writ large over everything they do. And when you find people where sustainability runs through them, it's just such a lovely place to find yourself really hopeful and optimistic and courageous. And yeah, it's like finding the Warriors.
Katherine Ann Byam 18:21
I agree with that so much. What would you say to other fashion designers interested in making a difference?
Karen Adams 18:30
I would say harness your courage and do it and get on mission, get all in, don't tinker around the edges and don't align with any organisations that aren't fully converted towards sustainability. Just don't dilute your cause. You have to go all in and your network, you have to surround yourself with people who are all in because if you try and hybrid it, it doesn't work actually is what I found to my cost. Because if you network and you harness yourself to people whose values don't reflect your own, there will be a crash at some point in the cost. So I'd say guard against that.
Katherine Ann Byam 19:08
I think that's great advice to be fair. And how can my listeners get involved and engaged and support what you're doing today?
Karen Adams 19:16
Ah, well, if you like what you hear and you want to save the planet, I'd love your support. You can start with a T-shirt, or you can start with a follow up. So my website is Kaia. clothing.co.uk. My Instagram link is on there. So please come say hi on Instagram, that would be great and follow along.
If you want to go further if you want to purchase a Fairtrade organic t-shirt, then please do that. That would be great. I'm trying to get a mass t-shirt conversion going on because it's such a ubiquitous garment that we all wear. So if you just swapped one of their T-shirts for a wind powered Fairtrade organic one, we could sell my mission for 2020 20 days. Two is to stop one tonne of co2 emissions. So if you want to join me on that quest, buy a t- shirt. And let's, let's, you know, let's get that counter moving so that we can stop a tonne of co2.
Katherine Ann Byam 20:11
Thank you so much, Karen, for coming on to the show. Really enjoyed the session. I think there's loads of great advice. I think of strong black women who are courageous and brave what it takes to be sustainable. You are an absolute beacon of light. So thank you for helping us to see always thank
Karen Adams 20:30
you so much. It's been great. Thank you for having me.